Do evil people know they are evil?
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Last week when I was refusing new food at the hypothetical dinner party I looked up the phrase “the evil I know” just to make sure I remembered it correctly. And that Google search led me to an interesting discussion regarding evil people.
The following question was posed by elmasahe:
Ever stop and wonder if people who are evil know that they are evil? If you ask yourself, “Do you consider yourself evil?” I think almost everyone would definitely say that they are good. It is hard for someone to admit that they are evil or that they are the villain in someone else’s life….
My opinion to this question is I don’t think that bad people know that they are bad. They would usually say that they are good and the people around them are the ones who are wrong.
I have to agree with elmasahe. I’m not sure it’s in the human psyche to accept the idea that you are evil.
Wait a minute. I think I’ve seen a few documentaries of convicted murderers who have actually admitted that they are evil. Although I’m pretty sure those folks still attributed that evil to some outside force.
So that still falls into my assessment that people are not wired to embrace evil. That’s a good thing but obviously it doesn’t stop evil from occurring in the world. Do sociopaths define themselves as evil?
According to Wikipedia, antisocial personality disorder, aka the sociopath, shows “lack of remorse, as indicated by being indifferent to or rationalizing having hurt, mistreated, or stolen from another.”
The fact that the sociopath rationalizes the behavior still makes me believe it’s not common to accept one’s self as evil.
I believe it’s nearly impossible for a human being to see himself as truly evil. There are always exceptions to the rule. However, the natural tendency is to justify or rationalize our actions. Over and over we see defendants explain their behavior by saying they had a terrible childhood, an intolerable living situation, etc.
I’m not suggesting that person is lying. I believe there are many people who experienced a terrible, traumatic childhood or insufferable living conditions.
I am saying that each one of us must take responsibility for our actions regardless of our history or experiences.
To a much lesser extent a good example of irrational justification (but not inherent evil behavior) is the person who successfully sued McDonald’s because she suffered burns from hot coffee purchased at the restaurant.
This woman is not evil and I am not suggesting that she is evil. I am suggesting that she is not taking responsibility for her own actions.
It’s common knowledge that coffee is hot. There was a warning printed on the cup “however the jury decided that the warning was neither large enough nor sufficient.”
She placed the coffee cup between her knees while sitting in the passenger seat of a car and pulled the lid toward herself to remove it. In the process, she spilled the entire cup of coffee on her lap.
That’s extremely unfortunate. But McDonald’s did not tell her to place the cup of coffee between her knees and then open the cup in her car. I think she made an unfortunate mistake and that it was her fault. Period.
But clearly she didn’t believe it was her fault. She did not take responsibility for making a poor choice and rationalized that it was irresponsible of the restaurant to serve coffee that was too hot.
She obviously believes she is justified in her opinion and the jury agreed with her. It does come down to a judgment call.
I believe on a much larger, exaggerated scale, those who commit evil acts still believe they are justified and the act itself was necessary. Responding to an attack — life threatening or not — is necessary and an automatic reaction. However there’s a huge difference between responding to an attack and initiating an attack.
As usual, there are always shades of gray, but I’m not talking about gray area. I’m talking about actions on the scale of Hitler. I’m sure he believed he was justified in his actions.
And I’m pretty sure everyone out there would agree he was evil.
I think this depends on one’s perception of “evil”. Consider the evil mother-in-law stereotype. From one point of view, she’s an interfering windbag. From the other, she’s just trying to protect her child. Is she evil, or not? I guess that depends on who you ask.
Is a 3-year-old who hits their younger sibling and steals their toy being evil?
True Solomon. In this instance I would say the mother-in-law is evil and the toddler is inherently evil. :)
I couldn’t resist.
It comes down to intent and further another person’s definition of intent. I still think we should all live and let live. MIL should keep her thoughts to herself and the 3-year-old needs to learn to share.
i’m sure i did something evil this past weekend and even told myself i was evil. it was a necessary evil so let’s call it a mercy killing, because i care.
“I am saying that each one of us must take responsibility for our actions regardless of our history or experiences.”
and if we did this we would all stop being a victim of someone else. we continually blame other people for where we are in life and we forget that we played some part in how we got there as well.
i made up my own disease for people who refuse to accept responsibility. i call it the adam syndrome. here i go back to the beginning, but adam, yeah that adam, was a punk – instead of confessing that he disobeyed God, he told him, the woman YOU gave to be with me, SHE gave me the fruit, so poor little me, i ate. the punk could have just said, yeah i ate it, my bad.
I love the Adam Syndrome~!~ You definitely need to trademark that. Wait, I’ll do it for you. It shall now be referred to as the Adam Syndrome™. (I hate ending a sentence on the ™ symbol. It makes the period look wonky.)
I’ve never thought of it that way — Adam blaming Eve — but that’s so true. Help me with my Bible knowledge, did Eve own it or did she blame it on the snake? And we all know, without questioning it, the snake was evil.
And since he was the devil, or the devil’s minion, he was aware of his evil nature. Interesting how the word devil contains the word evil. I’m sure that’s not a coincidence and snaps to whoever invented that word.
Alright, you just walked in, went directly to the mantle and silently picked up the Gold Star of the Day. No need to wait to see what else comes in. You earned it fair and square.
And I’m willing to own that.
The lady who sued was not evil, I believe evil is intentionally hurting other people for your own pleasure. I think we all have a little evil in us, but it’s how we handle it that makes the difference.
True, beanie. However, I still think that woman exhibited irrational justification. I also believe, like you said, that we all send out some evil in our lifetimes, but most people experience remorse.
It’s those few who don’t that I was referring to.
If someone deliberately shoots someone, and experiences remorse, they’re not evil? But if the same person shoots that same someone, and isn’t sorry (which they should have thought about before they shot someone), then they’re evil?
How does feeling remorse change the evilness of the shooter? The other person is still dead. It was still an intentional act. I don’t get this?
I believe the person in your scenario, Solomon, is evil in both cases — shooting and then feeling remorse as well as shooting and not feeling anything.
However when I said:
“…we all send out some evil in our lifetimes, but most people experience remorse.”
I meant we all have some amount of malicious intent. For example, when we were first married I washed my own laundry and left Mr. C to fend for himself before we went on vacation.
I was mad at him so I acted in a passive-aggressive way and my intent was to jack up his vacation. Even though I did feel remorse later on, my intent was malicious/evil. It just wasn’t on the level of shooting him in the head.
But I still think that was a level of evil (not washing his clothes) and at the time I felt justified. Now I think it was mean of me.
I don’t think truly evil people are aware that they are evil when they are doing their evil acts. With time some people may be able to look back and realize that their actions were truly evil (for example the serial killers you mentioned). However, I don’t think that is the norm.
In general, I believe that most people aspire to do what they believe to be appropriate/correct in most situations. The problem is that some peoples’ ways of thinking do not match up at all with societal norms.
Take Hitler for example. To most of the world, his actions are clearly evil. However in his mind, Hitler most likely thought that the mass murder of millions of people was the right move because:
1) “those people” were a true threat to Germany and its people,
2) the German people are superior to “those people” and therefore the rights of the Germans are more important than those of “those people” and
3) “those people” aren’t really people anyway, they are “subhuman” or something like that. The types of thoughts I ascribed to Hitler can really be ascribed to any of the greatest evils in history. FYI that’s why I used the phrase “those people” instead of Jews, gypsies, etc.
One of the Conversations with God books has a chapter that talks about this issue with a slightly different spin. The question in the book was basically would someone like Hitler go to heaven. It was extremely interesting (albeit probably controversial to most people) and thought provoking.
Well said Buf. I’m going to have to get that book because now I can’t wait to see what the argument is.
Thanks for cleaning up and organizing my post, it looks much better. :) If you do read that book I’d be interested in your opinion. Based on what I’ve seen on here, I have a guess as to how you might react. I’d be curious to see if I’m right…lol
No problem. I just can’t hold myself back when I want some paragraph breaks. Part of my obsessive tendencies.
Now I have to get the book. However my mind is playing tricks on me and I’m trying to anticipate what you think my reaction will be so I can surprise you. But then I just want to see what my actual reaction is just to know what I really thought.
My guess is that I’m not going to agree with the explanation, however, I will probably want to aspire to feel that level of forgiveness. I’ll let you know when I read it. Hey! Maybe that’s a post right there. I need to head off to the library.
Truly evil people are mentally off. I’m not sure if they know it or not.
I think you’re right, Poolie.
I hope we’re not going to start having “Heavy Mondays.”
People hate being accountable for their mistakes. They aren’t evil, just really good at lies and denial. “Wow, I would be quite the idiot for scalding myself on my own breakfast, it must not have been my fault.”
The mentally ill, the -opaths? Pedophiles and alcoholics are in the DSM. That mentally ill compulsion only holds so much water. I do think the courts do a fair job of only convicting those who truly do not know the difference between right and wrong. Even poor Andrea Yates had to appeal a guilty verdict and I think it was pretty obvious that poor woman had no place in prison, though she probably doesn’t have a place in society either.
I’m not even sure if “evil” exists.
Ooh, Heavy Mondays is a fun name for a band. Nah, we’re not making this a regular feature, I just found the question really interesting.
I have to respectfully disagree. I do think evil exists but there are certainly shades of gray. I didn’t realize alcoholism was in the DSM.
Again, I always learn something new from you.
It’s a very interesting question.
We can respectfully disagree, it’s cool. Now that I’m reading it, I didn’t really explain. I certainly think mentally off people act in atrociously malevolent ways, but I think it’s that whole the devil placed evil in the world to tempt us like it’s just floating around and we all have the ability to just one day slide into Sodom and Gomorrah is what I meant.
Yes, I just looked it up.
–noun 6. that which is evil; evil quality, intention, or conduct: to choose the lesser of two evils.
7. the force in nature that governs and gives rise to wickedness and sin. <— That's the part that doesn't stick with me.
8. the wicked or immoral part of someone or something:
9. harm; mischief; misfortune: to wish one evil.
10. anything causing injury or harm:
11. a harmful aspect, effect, or consequence:
12. a disease
Alcoholism is a subset of addiction, hence DSM.
Somehow I explained my whole theory behind no evil and I somehow made it disappear. So here’s why I don’t believe in “evil.” it’s a second, shorter version.
Evil is:
–noun 6. that which is evil; evil quality, intention, or conduct: to choose the lesser of two evils.
7. the force in nature that governs and gives rise to wickedness and sin. <——- that one. It just doesn't stick to me, maybe it was too much Sunday School.
8. the wicked or immoral part of someone or something: The evil in his nature has destroyed the good.
9. harm; mischief; misfortune: to wish one evil.
10. anything causing injury or harm: Tobacco is considered by some to be an evil.
11. a harmful aspect, effect, or consequence: the evils of alcohol.
12. a disease, as king's evil.
I don't argue really effed up people commit atrocious acts, but I think it's an internal force, not external.
I’m pretty much on the same page with you in regards to the internal not external force.
Now that you’re getting into the details I do think it comes from each person — their intent. Naturally there are many ways to interpret the intent, hence the gray areas.
I agree that it comes from within and might, possibly, be shaped by external influences, but I definitely think it’s the responsibility of the person.
Looks like I didn’t clarify my opinion of the genesis of evil. I don’t really think it’s floating around like pollution. I think it’s an individual choice each of us make.
And we totally agree on the psychos of the world.
Yeah, severe child abuse effs a person for life.
Hola Cardio,
I am going to turn on my inner psychologist for this one. Now from what I can remember about “evil peoples” aka sociopaths their emotional compass is nil. What I mean by that is they have no basis with which to gauge their behavior. Most folk recognize how their behavior will effect others and determine if those actions are right or wrong. Evil Peoples don’t have that inner debate because they can only see what they want and will do whatever it takes to get it. There is no actual rationalization because other’s feelings aren’t even a consideration.
Now on to your question will a person like this recognize his/her evilness…no. No because the concept of “evil” or “good” has no meaning to him/her as it does to the rest of us.
So this was pretty brain intensive…luckily I reserve my brain power for reading blogs as opposed to other stuff like say working!
Oops almost forgot…the McDonald trial jurors need a lesson in personal responsibility. Come now that one was almost as ridonkulous as the folks who awarded that woman money when she left the Winnebago on cruise control and went into the back to make a sandwich. This brainiac wonders why the home on wheels careened over a cliff. I don’t know maybe because auto pilot ain’t really a person. Boggles the mind!
Wow, your inner psychologist is pretty learnèd.
Quick side note: You may recall I wanted to know what the ` was and Buf explained it was the grave accent key. Then I wanted to know how to type it. Because sometimes I want to use it like I did up there.
This is how you do it, jack. Hold the ALT key and type these numbers — 0232. Voila! The grave e!
All of that makes sense and it does seem like the answer is a solid no — they don’t know it. And it looks like everyone pretty much agrees on that in here.
Faith you have earned the Gold Star of Day with this line:
…when she left the Winnebago on cruise control and went into the back to make a sandwich.
I jumped the gun by awarding it to Natural, but today I must award TWO. I think I’ve only done that once before.
But it is absolutely necessary today. Way to go.
First, we gotta acknowledge the whole spectrum of wrongdoing: on one end, you’ve got your genocidal/sociopathic lunatics, whom I think most people would generally describe as “evil.” But society is overwhelmingly comprised of we average, everyday folk doing our best to get through the day, and frequently screwing the pooch — and doing it more through what I’d call “unkindnesses.”
I like to think I’m a pretty conscious person, but catch me on a bad day, and I’m just as likely to take it out on the mister as anyone else — *definitely* not kind — and I’d say nearly all of us are prone to those sort of human failings. But a little further down that slippery slope are the folks who chronically use their moods/personal histories/personalities as excuses to verbally abuse or mistreat others “because that’s just how I am” or “because I’m just telling the truth,” when in fact such callousness is frequently a brittle shield for insecurities. (The MIL example, for instance: to think her beyotch is one thing; to call her a beyotch to her face would be an unkindness and say far more of you as a person than it did of *her* behavior.)
The difference between unkindness as an occasional failing and as a character trait? The ability to recognize when one’s acted poorly, accept responsibility, and offer an apology. Which when you think about it, covers most aspects of this conversation: the hitting 3-year-old, the suing coffee drinker, even to some degree the murderers and Hitlers of this world, if one is to believe Nelson Mandela’s statements on the power of forgiveness and reconciliation. . .
Certainly this one is full of slippery slopes but I suppose I’m referring to the sociopaths of which there seem to be more than a handful. Although statistically speaking there are probably not as many as I imagine.
The super crazy cases (Ted Bundy, Hitler, Jeffrey Dahmer, etc.) are the ones that get the publicity and I tend to focus on those and then generalize that there are many more hidden in the woodwork.
Oy, I think we all know the “because that’s just how I ams” of the world. Can’t stand those folks.
And I agree; IF most people were able to recognize when one’s acted poorly, accept responsibility, and offer an apology things would be much different in this world. I seriously attempt to follow that edict but there are probably times when I fail.
I own it and try to make the times I do bungle it up few and far between.
well, as someone who has been friends with a pathological liar (not with evil intent, though) I suspect that evil or bad people don’t realize what they are doing and how they appear to everyone else.
I remember once I went to my Dr to get my anti-depressant changed and I said “Everybody is pissing me off, so I know my meds aren’t working.” The nurse said “Most people think there’s something wrong with everyone else.”
???
I have evil tendencies. At times I can be really “bad”. At other times I’m so nice/good that I shock myself, LOL.
It’s interesting how important intent is in this example. I really do think that’s the key although not enough to excuse the person from being accountable.
I’m not sure how I would take that statement from the nurse.
So when you feel you’re being evil, what do you think of that? Do you just accept that you’re gonna do it and then move on or do you feel remorse and attempt to make amends?
I don’t like Wiki’s definition of sociopath. EVERYONE tries to justify what they do – to others, to themselves. I thought a sociopath just didn’t care, had no feelings about it, no guilt ever.
And I just realized that my aunt, whom I’ve always thought of as evil, might totally be a sociopath. Like, for real. True evil.
I figured it had to have both criteria: people who justify what they do AND don’t care about the consequences AND don’t feel remorse. In all seriousness, I think my nephew is a sociopath.
My comment disappeared again. I must be spamming.
I don’t know why that happened. It was sitting in the moderation cue waiting to be approved. Which it was. You’re always approved over here, chica.
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